February 23rd, 2020
73 comments
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Now that the Ninth episode of series 12 has aired what did you think? Was it everything you had hoped for or not what you expected.
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The Moffat Paradox
February 27th, 2020 - 1:25pmIts for the moderator to decide whose really being a troll and even people who have been more receptive to the Chibnall/Whittaker tenure here seem to now have misgivings.
Doctor Stu
February 27th, 2020 - 1:09pmQuieting the trolls suggests that everyone is happy with this era of Doctor Who though, which quite clearly most people aren’t. Chibnall can’t be content in thinking everything’s perfect, he needs to see the positives and negatives so he can shape his era going forward, I’m not suggesting Chibnall reads these comments of course he doesn’t but silencing negative opinions is never a good thing
The Ergon
February 27th, 2020 - 9:37amBooboo. How about deleting these depressing trolls. They aren,t here to answer the question at hand, they are just looking for a way in for a voice and an argument. Its the positives and the theories on the episodes we want to read. If they don,t like Jodie we already know as its the same voices who keep reminding us all but there are people who do like her. I,m on the fence but i don,t continually go on about it.
Mick C
February 27th, 2020 - 1:20amThere is a lot more Streaming services than just Netflix these days guys, Amazon(LOTR, WOT, the Expanse) could be a good fit for Dr Who and they are not afraid to commit to multiple seasons from the start.
I wouldn’t go HBO though or we would have orgy’s in the Tardis and the Doctor swearing like an old trooper.
Time Maker
February 26th, 2020 - 10:52pmMy Top 5 favourite Parts of Ascension of the Cybermen
* Great to see the events of the Cyberwar first mentioned in Nightmare in Silver, having humanity being brought to near extinction is actually quite a possible outcome considering Cybermen primarily upgrade their prey into more cybermen and delete those that refuse. Seeing all the dead cyberman parts through space was chilling and awesome to see. I was particularly pleased that this episode is keeping in continuity by having the 2006 design for the cybermen used in the cyberwar since the 2013 design comes many years after the war.
* I had a feeling the Lone Cyberman was someone who willingly became converted into a cyberman due to still retaining emotions yet preferring to remain loyal to the cyber cause, this episode made the character even more disturbing due to his god complex after being rejected from the cybermen at first then later deciding to torture one of the Cybermen out of seemingly pure spite before using the thousands of others as a giant army.
* I adore the design of these new cyber warriors, a cool look of futuristic architecture mixed with medieval armour, modern highlights and classic series inspiration. one of my favourite moments with them was seeing the lone cyberman leading them through the ship and we get a clear view of hundreds more marching on the upper decks. I can’t wait to see them in a fight in the next episode.
* Interesting to see Graham team up with Yaz this time around rather than Ryan and also nice to see all of them learning from the Doctor that there is always a way out. The Survivors of the Cyberwars where a real mixed bunch ranging from very realistic emotions during such a situation like the hopeful and resourceful to the Scared and pessimistic (Graham made me laugh by calling one of the Eeyore!)
* Interesting plot twist to see Gallifrey through the space rift and to make it better who should come through but The Master! though I was pretty sure he would turn up in the final anyway, still great to see the latest incarnation quickly shifting from maniacal maniac to warning weirdo as we get closer to unravelling this bizarre mystery. admittedly I am a little concerned as this is now the third time we have had a series final two parter to feature both cybermen and the Master (Lets hope it’s the last as I feel some other monsters deserve that special spot light).
This was a solid first part to a series finale and It ended with me hoping to watch the second part immediately after! although considering all the plot twists that somehow connect with this timeless child arc I do fear that the next episode will be overstuffed with complicated lore and I am kind of worried as there is a very strong 50/50 chance this mystery will really anger the fan base. as for this episode what I personally didn’t like where the out of place segments with the invincible orphan policeman and his shady non aging guardians. not once did it relate to the events in this episode and every time it came on I wanted them to hurry it up so we could get back to the cyberman story, I hope the next episode has a good way of tying it all together.
Doctor Stu
February 26th, 2020 - 9:41pmI’m rewatching the episode now and just noticed that when the Doctor says ‘Ko Sharmus? You’re a man not a planet’ he doesn’t actually answer. And the planet they’re on has a similar cliff beach segment like what Brendan fell off. That’s not a coincidence surely? Do you think that Ko Sharmus’s planet is actually earth? Might explain why the gateway leads to gallifrey with the whole timeless child subplot
Doctor Stu
February 26th, 2020 - 6:32pmI read something where Sacha says how the plot line to be revealed is very reflective of the times we live in or something like that. So yikes I feel like there’s going to be something revealed that people just aren’t going to like at all. Maybe women timelords being forcefully replace by men or something. God knows what it is I just feel like people are gonna be rolling their eyes
Broken Cylon
February 26th, 2020 - 3:32pmI would definitely not want this show to go to netflix, I wouldn’t want them trying to fluff it up w/swear words or graphic violence for ratings, they have a habit of just cancelling good shows out of nowhere & I don’t see them being committed to a show like this for the long haul…don’t get me wrong, I really like netflix, but not for this series…
This show belongs at BBC where they’re familiar w/the historical properties & where, imo, have at least maintained the simple core values of this series…
Doctor Stu
February 26th, 2020 - 1:55pmDoctor who needs to stay as far away from Netflix as possible, show it on BBC first and then add it to Netflix sure. But to take it off television when it’s a British BBC iconic program is just wrong. I’d rather it just get rested for a few years than that
Lorraine
February 26th, 2020 - 1:21pmI know this is my second quote Booboo but I do agree that it would be great if the programme could be sold to Netflix as long as they keep to canon. Rather that than the programme die which I fear it will once the deal with HBO expires. I think a lot of Scifi lovers including myself watch a lot of Netflix now and therefore it would be a better venue with more money able to be spent on all aspects of the show.
Anonymous
February 26th, 2020 - 12:11pmMy Top 5 favourite Parts of Ascension of the Cybermen
* Great to see the events of the Cyberwar first mentioned in Nightmare in Silver, having humanity being brought to near extinction is actually quite a possible outcome considering Cybermen primarily upgrade their prey into more cybermen and delete those that refuse. Seeing all the dead cyberman parts through space was chilling and awesome to see. I was particularly pleased that this episode is keeping in continuity by having the 2006 design for the cybermen used in the cyberwar since the 2013 design comes many years after the war.
* I had a feeling the Lone Cyberman was someone who willingly became converted into a cyberman due to still retaining emotions yet preferring to remain loyal to the cyber cause, this episode made the character even more disturbing due to his god complex after being rejected from the cybermen at first then later deciding to torture one of the Cybermen out of seemingly pure spite before using the thousands of others as a giant army.
* I adore the design of these new cyber warriors, a cool look of futuristic architecture mixed with medieval armour, modern highlights and classic series inspiration. one of my favourite moments with them was seeing the lone cyberman leading them through the ship and we get a clear view of hundreds more marching on the upper decks. I can’t wait to see them in a fight in the next episode.
* Interesting to see Graham team up with Yaz this time around rather than Ryan and also nice to see all of them learning from the Doctor that there is always a way out. The Survivors of the Cyberwars where a real mixed bunch ranging from very realistic emotions during such a situation like the hopeful and resourceful to the Scared and pessimistic (Graham made me laugh by calling one of the Eeyore!)
* Interesting plot twist to see Gallifrey through the space rift and to make it better who should come through but The Master! though I was pretty sure he would turn up in the final anyway, still great to see the latest incarnation quickly shifting from maniacal maniac to warning weirdo as we get closer to unravelling this bizarre mystery. admittedly I am a little concerned as this is now the third time we have had a series final two parter to feature both cybermen and the Master (Lets hope it’s the last as I feel some other monsters deserve that special spot light).
This was a solid first part to a series finale and It ended with me hoping to watch the second part immediately after! although considering all the plot twists that somehow connect with this timeless child arc I do fear that the next episode will be overstuffed with complicated lore and I am kind of worried as there is a very strong 50/50 chance this mystery will really anger the fan base. as for this episode what I personally didn’t like where the out of place segments with the invincible orphan policeman and his shady non aging guardians. not once did it relate to the events in this episode and every time it came on I wanted them to hurry it up so we could get back to the cyberman story, I hope the next episode has a good way of tying it all together.
The Moffat Paradox
February 26th, 2020 - 10:32amAlternatively to add to Mick C’s points let fans put more of their own non profit but sufficiently glossy productions of Who online for streaming which CBS allows under guidelines for Star Trek,
Broken Cylon
February 26th, 2020 - 3:01amRegarding viewing numbers, maybe there’s just too much competition on Sundays & they might fare better going back to Saturday.? Just putting it out there…
Mick C
February 26th, 2020 - 12:19amGuys it’s the mid 80s all over again, an unpopular Doctor and companions(Graeme excepted) a generation of younger people who have grown up and getting on with there lives(i was one back then) and now think Scifi type shows are boring and silly or simply have a limited time to watch TV, just no longer able to hold on to more casual viewers
Doctor Who is above all a Sci fi show and no one today would start one without a $3-5m per episode budget, Dr Who is $1.5m per episode. The only thing that would have saved Dr Who in 1989 was a major injection of money to improve the quality of FX , writing and production.
While the quality of FX currently in Dr Who isn’t to bad it comes at the expense of quantity and we seem to be drifting back to the Pertwee era with nearly all episodes set on Earth, even this episode though set on another planet had the look of current day Earth tp it.
Imagine what you could do with the $15m per episode GOT got in its last season or the $1b being spent on a 5 season run of the new LOTR TV show. This will be an unpopular opinion but i think it might be time for BBC to sell off Dr Who to a streaming service that would be prepared to put the type of cash needed to keep Dr Who going, with the Caveat that it must remain true to itself.
Unfortunately new Who is fast running out of steam and I’m not sure anything else can save it now and it probably started when Smith left
Lorraine
February 25th, 2020 - 2:24pmJodie says she is doing another season and allegedly they will start filming later this year for transmission 2021 so it doesn’t matter how bad the acting and writing is. The BBC will do this as they have been paid by HBO for that series I believe however with these viewing figures I think WHO is in real trouble. Jodie and the Fam have failed terribly (save for Bradley) and apart for the Mary Shelley episode which I did enjoy I have found most quite disappointing. When I think of the Murray Gold music which used to accompany the cybermen and the rubbish music we get now I think that says it all – inexperience in all departments. Just diversity tick-box routine. Get woke go broke…eventually. My favourite programme what a shame.
The Moffat Paradox
February 25th, 2020 - 10:13amWell with the consolidated viewing figures becoming more of a weaker defence in the context of the licence fee being potentially decriminalised even before BBC Charter renewal and the cost of production relative to actual viewer interest not just in the UK but elsewhere becoming more of a hard sell for the BBC the phrase I’m often hearing is:
“Go woke go broke”.
The Ergon
February 25th, 2020 - 9:42amGreat set up for the finale. I wasn,t keen on ‘Handles’ and his flying posse. There are lots of theories abound but i was more interested in the significance of Adrics broken badge in that trailer. Is that a foreboding that another companion is going to die at the hands of the cybermen and will Graeme stay behind with Ravio on Gallifrey? If Ryan is killed off as some are suggesting, Graeme wouldn,t have anything to return to.
Anonymous
February 25th, 2020 - 8:58am3.71 million is disgusting for show in prime time slot especially when programmes before and after are getting higher
Tim M
February 24th, 2020 - 4:03pm3.71 million overnight viewing figures for the latest episode. The Eighth most watched show of the day. A shame as on the whole I felt it was the strongest episode of the Whitaker era yet. But clearly something in the show needs to radically change. The most radical would be changing the leads, in particular, the Doctor. I don’t feel Jodie Whitaker ever really fitted the role, and that is obviously an issue for many viewers. She just doesn’t seem strong enough to carry a series like this, and lacks the gravitas the role does require. The writing hasn’t always helped either.
Pats86
February 24th, 2020 - 2:32pmIf permitted I would like to reply to whovian?
Yes I like many characters including Jo Martin`s Doctor and she does count simply because she is a character in the show, how could she not count?
Bradley Walsh is excellent and should have been cast as the Doctor. Sacha Dhawan is brilliant as the Master.
I am aware some think Jodie is a good Doctor? I do not, she has no presence whatsoever, she is not even a half decent Doctor and has been miscast unfortunately for us. Personally I expect better from the lead and the sooner she goes the better.
And yes I am interested in your theories, all three are very interesting, thanks for sharing.
Doctor Stu
February 24th, 2020 - 1:44pmMaybe a bunch of time lords are actually humans that have their memories wiped time and time again
Pats86
February 24th, 2020 - 1:16pmThinking about Brendan and Jo Martin`s Doctor, could it be that we will see a few different Doctors in the final?
If we go back to The brain of Morbius episode we see the 4th Doctor have several images of himself, so are they former Doctors or not?
Brendan was in pain when he had those earphones put on him and his mind wiped, the Master told the doctor in the preview clip “brace yourself this is going to hurt”? will the Doctor’s memories of former selves come back?
Or is brendan another Time Lord?
So many questions and for the first time in a long time I am excited for the next episode.
whovian
February 24th, 2020 - 1:15pmPats86, completely agree with you about Ryan being outacted by the Cybermen in hibernation, he just cannot seem to shift his voice tone from a monotone sound.
However, as quite a few people gave said, including me myself,Jodie is a brilliant Doctor, only downside to her version of the character is that she relies on that screwdriver way too much, but that’s just the writing unfortunately.
And also Captain Jack, insufferable? Is there anyone in this show that you actually DO like? And that Ruth “Doctor” does not count.
To all those who are interested, I do have a couple of theories about what’s going on:
The Timeless Child/Children are characters like the mysterious Brendan, possibly a chameleon arch situation that resets Time Lords/Gallifreyans to infants when they get too old, therefore being “Timeless”
Or another possible, but very unlikely theory, is that the Cybermen are on their way to Gallifrey & become the Time Lords/Gallifreyans themselves OR the Cybermen actually ARE the Timeless Children, as Cybermen dont age
Or it could just be a ruse by the Master to confuse the Doctor & try & make her believe that something is true when it actually isn’t, this is the Master after all & no matter whether male or female, they are always insane
Anonymous
February 24th, 2020 - 11:59amAll the hype of cybermen and epic battles and it still gets lowest viewing audience needs new producer now not in few years
Pats86
February 24th, 2020 - 10:19amEnjoyed it best episode of the last two seasons, a few niggles like the Cybermen head drones, Ryan (Tosin Cole) as usual was out acted by the cybermen that were in hibernation.
I found all the scenes without Jodie in them of high quality, especially Graham, Bradley Walsh is carrying this show on his own just about.
Saying that Jodie was less irritable than normal but unfortunately she still comes across as a very weak Doctor (hopefully next week we will see Jo Martin`s Doctor and she can show Jodie how it should be Done)
The Master is back and Sacha Dhawan is brilliantly cast, with lots of questions yet to be resolved I really am looking forward to the final. And who is Bendan?
Only real concern is the possibility of the insufferable Captain Jack making an unwelcome appearance.
All in all a good episode let down by Tosin Cole and Jodie, Just imagine how good the last two series would have been with a decent actor playing the Doctor, never mind at least we know a regeneration will occur at some point in the near future!
6/10
Anonymous
February 24th, 2020 - 10:18amAnyone else feel Chibnall just ripping of Superman’s origin story was lazy writing ? And the Cyber drones, they just looked looked daft.
Anonymous
February 24th, 2020 - 9:45amI think Brendan is linked to the timeless children. Pure speculation just a little thought I had concerning either time travel or more likely regeneration energy. Also I don’t think ruth is linked to the timeless child idea. I think that will continue into next years series. Now people need to be a bit sensible if there is no ruth explanation. I imagine that lots of fans will explode in indignation! But remember how long it took for the crack in time explanation? First episode was eleventh hour in 2010 and not fully resolved until 2013’s time and the doctor. Sometimes patience is a good thing. Oh, by the way, kudos to the the new cyberman design.
prototype dalek
February 24th, 2020 - 9:42amI’m just waiting for the second part to properly judge, hard to get an idea from just 1 part. Though some things I did pick up on were that:
1) I think the new cybermen drones could have been better personally, we have had Cybermats that were totally different so personally think they could have come up with better design then just the head of a 2006 Cyberman floating around, great idea but poor execution.
2) How did the new designs come about? 2006 were cybus industries, 2013 rebuilt damaged cybermen but now an entire new class of cyberman out of the blue. Also if these are warrior class then what does that make a standard Cyberman? Though I did like the classic hint to them.
3) If there were only 3 Cybermen left in the universe (except the army they happened to find), why kill the last few humans when their main objective is to upgrade them, isn’t it counter productive to the main Cyberman plan to upgrade?
4) If 2 cyber ships arrived, with only 3 cybermen emerging, does this mean they all arrived on one ship (if so how did the other ship fly and why didn’t more cybermen come out the other), or Ashad on one ship and 2 on the other?
5) In addition to this, Ashad is half converted human, half 2013 Cyberman, so why were the 2 guards Cyber Legion Cybermen? Shouldn’t it have been the newer 2013 ones, especially that the new warrior class are much updated 2013 design on the cyber ship.
6) Lastly, how did they crash on a what seems to be a perfectly intact ship with no active cybermen inside, but there are hundreds of dead cybermen floating outside, and yet all the warrior class cybermen are still there undamaged? I don’t see how the ship, which seemed to be completely undamaged and important, can be abandoned with a giant army ready to be used.
Just a few things I would like to be cleared up, maybe they might at the finale but who knows.
Time_lord_box
February 24th, 2020 - 7:58amWhat do you guys think about Brendon?
Pauluus
February 24th, 2020 - 7:42amWeek this season has gotten better as it goes on but I think there will be a lot of disappointment after next weeks episode because I can’t see any resolution to all the question thrown up since prisoner of the Judoon. I get the feeling that a lot of things are being set up for next year….