May 20th, 2013
372 comments
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The Final Moments of The Name of the Doctor
The Final Moments of The Name of the Doctor – Doctor Who Series 7 Part 2 2013
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Professor When
May 19th, 2013 - 8:00amHe was the disgraced Doctor… he was wearing black, he disgraced the ‘Name’ of the Doctor, perhaps not using it. Clara hadn’t seen him, so he wasn’t a past regeneration. However, he was there, so perhaps he was a future one who had interfered with the Doctor’s Past. There you have it: The Valeyard. 🙂
Brother John
May 19th, 2013 - 7:57amNo, the current Clara is the original Clara. The echos are echos of her. No timey-wimey, chicken-and-egg stuff needed. But if you want to believe she’s a loop, sure. Doesn’t really affect the plot, though.
Dr who
May 19th, 2013 - 7:53amI think he is the one at war with the silence
Wiichigo
May 19th, 2013 - 7:52amHe’s a regeneration we haven’t seen before, not a future doctor. This rogue incarnation is the doctors biggest secret. Evidence to support this:
1) Clara saw all eleven incarnations of the doctor, and recognized them as such
2) Clara didn’t see any future iterations of the doctor, only the past ten.
3) Clara had no idea who the rogue doctor was.
4) The doctors biggest secret. The doctor is aware of this rogue regeneration. He explains to Clara and the audience the significance of his name; by choosing this name he made a promise of how he would act and live. This mystery doctor broke the promise, he didn’t live AS the doctor. His actions don’t fit with what the doctor stands for.
Clara was able to identify all previous versions of the doctor, but why wasn’t she able to identify the new one? The title of the episode reveals a clue. The name of the doctor – it was never about his real name. It’s about what makes the doctor who he is. The actions and course he has taken to protect the universe countless times. That is his promise. His actions define him.
Moffat himself backs up this notion twice in the episode. When river hears the criminals words in the conference call she realised the others had it wrong, had attached a too literal meaning to the words. Many fans have already made the same mistake with the reveal at the end of this excellent episode. Again at the end, the doctor is indignant when he denounces the actions of the rogue by proclaiming “not In the name of the Doctor”….
The secret? This doctor is his past, a past we haven’t seen before. That places him as either the true eighth or ninth doctor. This rogue doctor has done something that is dichotomous to everything the doctor stands for. What the name represents to the universe, and to us as viewers. Clara didn’t recognize the rogue as the doctor because technically, he isn’t. He’s a regeneration of the doctor alright, but he has done something so terrible she doesn’t recognize him. And this is the kicker – will we as viewers when we find out for ourselves?
This is probably the most important point in the entire episode. She was in his time stream, knew everything he ever did or will do. The rogue has done something truly terrible. It is for others to debate what exactly that is. The last time war seems like a good fit, but its the excellent Steven Moffat at the helm. One thing I’ve learned while watching the show (with Moffat in charge) is the end reveal will be clever and unexpected.
Also, WHAT an episode!!!!
Matt Smithy
May 19th, 2013 - 7:44amI believe this:
Matt Smith IS the 11th Doctor, but not the 11th incarnation of the PERSON. Clara says she saw all 11 Doctors and that he is the 11th Doctor, but then the Doctor goes on to say that the name you choose is a promise. John Hurts Doctor must have been the one that destroyed Gallifrey and Skaro, But because of this, he was no longer fit to be called “the Doctor”, therefore breaking the promise. Whenever we see the faces, the enemy has been told to look up “the Doctor”, not the only incarnation he was that used his real name. I believe that John Hurt is technically the real 9th Doctor, and when he regenerated to Chris, he wanted to start fresh again, calling himself The Doctor. Unfortunately, this means The Doctor only has 1 life left D:
Daniel
May 19th, 2013 - 7:40amFrom what we saw of Hurt’s costume is had similarities to the 8th’s?
Mike
May 19th, 2013 - 7:24amI think most people have missed a key simple point. All the other incarnations of the doctor were running. In The memories they were running or fleeing. This one stood his ground and wasn’t running. This doctor (John Hirt) doesn’t do what the other doctors did. So he was the one that stood up and fought. A zeroth doctor would make sense. An image of himself he is always running from. Mentally and physically.
Chris
May 19th, 2013 - 7:05amJohn Hurts is the first incarnation of ” the doctor” before taking that title, his name was Rassilon! The great architect of Timelord society…. or the tyrannical Imperator of Galiffrey? Much remains unclear as to what or even who Rassilon was/is in timelord lore & society. The doctor is fleeing the monster he created in timelord society & ashamed of the ways he chose to create it.
anonymous
May 19th, 2013 - 7:01amAccording to several episodes, the Doctor wouldn’t know a future regeneration of himself. “spoilers!” But, some people have said Hurt might be the Valeyard. I did some research, since I am too young to have watched the classic series, and the Valeyard is an evil amalgamation of the Doctor himself. It is stated that he occurs “somewhere between 12th and 13th regeneration”, according to an episode of the 6th doctor, “the Ultimate Foe”.
Also, Simeon states in “The Name of the Doctor”, at 23 minutes into the episode, “the doctor will have other names. Storm, Beast, Valeyard.” It is also stated in the classic series that since the 6th doctor met the Valeyard, and has knowledge of him: “The memory of the Sixth Doctor becomes increasingly associated with the Valeyard in the Seventh Doctor’s mind, causing the past five Doctors to ‘lock’ the Sixth Doctor’s memory away for fear of what he might become.” Therefore, when 11 says “he’s me… I didn’t say he was the Doctor” makes total sense. That would also explain why his face has never shown up during the database flashbacks, and why Clara didn’t know him.
Dr who
May 19th, 2013 - 6:58amI think john hurt doctor is the one who the silence were at an endless bitter war with
anonymous
May 19th, 2013 - 6:16amI like GameChicken’s theory. We know this: the Doctor said “he’s me…I didn’t say he was the Doctor”. Also, I don’t think he would have been before the first doctor, because Matt Smith said “the name you choose is like a promise… He’s the one who broke the promise.” How could he have broken the promise if he was before Hartnell? He had to have chosen the name, thus becoming the Doctor in order to have broken it. Plus, he should be in the past, since 11 knows him. In the episode from season 4 “The Next Doctor”, 10 meets a man who is calling himself the doctor and assumes he must be a future incarnation, since he didn’t know him. Some people have commented that he’s a time traveler and could go into the future to meet a new doctor, but the doctor has said time and again, that you can’t know the future because it contains “spoilers.” (references: “Silence in the Library”, “Forest of the Dead”, “The Angels take Manhattan”)
So, either he came in between the 8th and 9th, but not as a regeneration of the Doctor, but as a whole new “Bob”, to reference GameChicken. Another idea, he might be an aged version of the 8th Doctor, so twisted by what he had done in the time war, that he no longer considered himself the Doctor. His face wouldn’t show up in the database references, cause they use the younger face of 8, who hasn’t broke the promise. Besides, in the first episode with Christopher Eccelson, “Rose”, he obviously has just regenerated, because he looks in the mirror, and makes a comment about his new face.
Anonymous
May 19th, 2013 - 5:59amThere was already another dr from the bbc animated series played by Richard e grant. Aparantly he played a version of the ninth dr in scream of the shalka so maybe the ninth dr was split into 2 or even 3 with John hurt being one of them
anonymous
May 19th, 2013 - 5:45amIf the Doctor can regenerate 12 times, that means there would be 13 Doctors. Simply math, people. First Doctor was born, then regenerated for the 1st time into the second Doctor, and so on… leaving the 12th regeneration into the 13th Doctor.
the1chris
May 19th, 2013 - 5:35amI loved this episode a lot! And i like a lot of the theories on here, but my 1 comment is this…The Doctor (Matt) recognized and knew the doctor (John Hurt). To me that implies that he has to be a past incarnation. If you remember the mini episode from the Tennant era, Tennant wasn’t recognized and had to explain who he was. My guess is that John Hurt is either an embarrassing and hidden away 9th doctor or the original carnation before he takes the name The Doctor and turns his life around for good.
Alex
May 19th, 2013 - 4:36amErm…John Hurt is the name of the actor…
ergo, the Doctors name is NOT John Hurt 😛
Zedlar
May 19th, 2013 - 4:35ammate, its timey wimey stuff
Dalek: the Supreme
May 19th, 2013 - 3:33amMaybe he’s an in-between Doctor, between 8 and 9, like there was a Doctor Who fanmade special featuring the Doctor between Troughton and Pertwee.
Dalek: the Supreme
May 19th, 2013 - 3:31amThe Tenth Doctor in Journey’s End was referring to the Ninth Doctor.
Dalek: the Supreme
May 19th, 2013 - 3:24amSounds like a very interesting idea, definately one I’d watch!
Anonymous
May 19th, 2013 - 3:16amTo elaborate on what I wrote above,
This incarnation did something terrible and it was done in the name of the Doctor, his REAL name, the one given to him on Gallifrey. The title of the episode is a wordplay on that. That is why Clara could not see his timestream.
jack
May 19th, 2013 - 3:11amfinally ! someone with sense and actual
knowledge of the show 🙂
jack
May 19th, 2013 - 3:09amvery good thought , however you seem to think that the doctor has always been the last of the timelords since the show began in 1963 and the doctor named himself ” after ” the time war. however , the last great time war took place somewhere between the 8th and 9th regerneration of the doctor.
throughout the classic series the timelords can be seen numerous amounts of times such as when the doctor was forced to regenerate his 2nd incarnarion ( Patrick troughton ) to his 3rd incarnation ( jon pertwee ) by the timelords and was banished to earth.
JULIUS
May 19th, 2013 - 2:37amSIMPLE… Its the Doctor before the TimeWar. The Doctor gave himself the name after the TimeWar because of what he had done.
Its the 50th anniversary so theyre going to make a really special episode that probably involves Gallafray leading up to the moment he gave himself the name Doctor.
Hes not the 12th Doctor but you could say hes the Doctor Zero. lol. “The Doctor” was born in Battle so.. use your imagination. If im wrong then the writers need imagination.
anyway. im kindah new to doctor who so if i have any info wrong. forgivenessss
Wild Wolfie
May 19th, 2013 - 2:34amThe ‘Secret’ is the Doctors name. By revealing his name it reveals this incarnations timestream,that is why Clara could not see this incarnation in the Doctors timesream. This incarnation did something terrible, something that was against everything the Doctor stands for, even worse it was done in the name of the Doctor. This is a wretched incarnation that cannot be forgiven even by his other incarnations.In otherwords he cannot forgive himself for his own actions. Thus he cannot even be called the Doctor anymore and can only go by his real Gallifreyan name, a name the Doctor is ashamed of. To know this name is to know this incarnations timestream and what he did.
Frankie
May 19th, 2013 - 2:15amI have a pretty good theory on this you know, did anyone ever consider that everytime the doctor regenerates he’s a completely new person but inherits the the memories of the past doctors? so maybe this guy was the 9th and (matt smith) the 11th has the memories of what the previous doctor did? remember we saw all the doctors past incarnations, yet only this guy was questioned and was standing there, basically, i think the “doctor” is just a name/title, but every time the “doctor” regenerates he’s a completly new person but also has the memories of the old incarnation, Remember when David Tennant did the regeneration his words were “i don’t want to change it’s too soon” or something similar which brings me to this, the guy we saw has to be the 9th doctor, sorry for my explanation though, im not the best at explaining things lol
Don
May 19th, 2013 - 1:56amYes i also thought the same thing as if John Hurt was almost trying to make Matt Smith forgive him in a way and then this leads to john hurt not being accepted back into the ranks of the doctors maybe? and going onto him returning that could be possible but hard to pull off i reckon.
also i think they will consider or have already decided to basically make the Valeyard appear as John Hurt thus making two things appear as one, the valeyard appears and also this would create a new timeline of doctors as matt smith is the supposed 12th doctor now and making sure that the valeyard appears at his supposed time which is near the end of the doctors last reincarnation (as long as we are sticking with the original number of 12)
also this clip could be the hint for Valeyard and thus aka himself – http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NRoXBY0kqFo
Garry
May 19th, 2013 - 1:49amI’d love a flashback on the time war, but not a brief five second one. But one thing I really hope for is that the 50th anniversary special will be a long episode, 90 minutes to two hours or something like that… I’d also like to see some form of flashback on Trenzalore and what transpired there tbh.
Don
May 19th, 2013 - 1:39amif they dont bring it in it will be so disappointing.
Don
May 19th, 2013 - 1:36amYes it seemed that way as if John Hurt was trying to get Matt Smith to forgive him yet he obviously thinks badly of the john hurt doctor for whatever evil thing that has happened… but people do seem to have good points here, i think that the Valeyard and the bad doctor that people think was created in the time war must come into this somehow… although i can see the makers of Doctor Who combining it all like this,
The Valeyard is the same bad doctor created in the time war after doing whatever evil deeds and if you remember this
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NRoXBY0kqFo
you can see that this would be where they hint at John Hurt in the first place.
The only thing they would need to do is explain what and how John Hurt did his bad actions and then go on to show him returning in some way
GameChicken
May 19th, 2013 - 1:30amI think maybe he is between 8th and 9th doctor, but is not going by the name of Doctor, so that’s why Clara didn’t see him, she was only following the doctor. What bothers me about that though, is that she was scattered throughout his entire life, so still would have ran into Hurt. Alternatively, I agree that he may be the man who became the doctor, before he began to ‘run’. Really we can’t know till we see it, I’ve been writing a book recently about a time lord, and you find that with time travel and timelord type stuff, everything becomes somewhat.. Massagable, you know, to fit around obstacles, paradoxes etc. In reality, the doctor, and all of the timelords are rather stupid with the power they possess, a good timelord would never need to regenerate, not once.